By the way, i have tried this in quite a few 9-seat SnGs, and I made the final table 100% of the time.
Clearly, it’s an optimal strategy for making final tables in 9-seat SnGs.
Maya, you deny bingo has every scientific foundation.
This is only because you don’t know the scientific approach to bingo and lottery of many Italians, especially Neapolitans.
Their choice of numbers is strictly based on their dreams! In Italy there are several “Book of Dreams”, which are not to be confused with Sigmund Freud’s “The Interpretation of Dreams”. They tell you exactly what is the corresponding number to your dream.
The employees of Lottery shops in Naples are great experts. Freud would be green with envy! If, for example, I go there and say: I dreamed I was in a gondola with George Clooney and we kissed each other, they would immediately say: Venice = 24; gondola = 48; gorgeous man = 62; kiss = 80, lucky you! = 55.
We could apply the same scientific method to bingo play in poker, too. You dreamed you are drinking a mojito on a Caribbean Island (a recurrent dream of mine)? Here are the results: island = JJ; cocktail = 9T offsuit; blue sky = AT suited; sunshine = TT; seaside = 88.
With those cards in your hand you can’t lose, go always all-in pre-flop!
If you wish, do take note of your dreams, send the results to me in a private message, and I’ll consult some Neapolitan friends of mine. They’ll be glad to tell you with what cards you can go all-in pre-flop, and when you should refrain from it.
That has peaked my curiosity. I believe I will try to fold every hand, preflop in a 9-seat SnG, and see if I make the final table! It is a strategy I have considered many times.
I had no idea that Neapolitans were such prophets. I do however, know that they make the best ice cream sandwiches.
(Sample SNG) yes, the whole thing, keep watching, grey guy takes 2nd … I took 1st.
Simmilarly, I play’d a Marathon Promotion the same way…
Since we want hard facts, and lots of data …
Thats a total of 355 Sngs in 1 week , with 97 top 3s ( cashes ). ( ohh 505 KOs )
Do I normally play SnGs this way, heck no… I was Hunting KOs, plain/simple.
I’ve won the monthly Low SnG LB, so don’t say I can’t go for “ave finish”.
( within the last 3 months )
I am not Bragging 1 bit… I’m saying if a certain Goal lends itself to certain
strategies, and its NL … then this is not only viable, but its profitable.
No Limit Texas Holdem, has the 1 variable I like… you can put anyont to the test :
" Are your cards good enuff to risk your tournament life ", when you get them all-in.
I cannot say that any differently… if thats uneasy for you, then I might suggest
that you not play NL Tournament Poker, and stick to Rings.
Hard evidence and lots of data? 1 promo, 1 week, 355 games, made it to top 3 in 27% of them, definitely not played preflop all in every single hand in all of them, and even if you did, it’s still too insufficient to come up with any scientific conclusion to say the least. Unfortunately it’s just another bunch of data, not useful for any type of conclusion, and definitely not enough runs to come up with anything. But it’s definitely a list of data, no one can argue with that. It’s probably more useful on a personal level to evaluate own achievements and performance, but nothing to do with the main topic.
The most scientific experiment with objective results ever conducted on the forums is the challenge done by @love2eattacos at low stake tables. That was, in my opinion, the best experiment and I think we can all learn from it. Other than that it’s always people posting hands and results and statistics that prove absolutely nothing. Just my opinion, please don’t sue me for it.
If the contention is that bingo is not a valid strategy, it takes exactly 1 occasion showing that it worked to disprove the idea. One.
Statistical data would be required to say it’s the best strategy, but nobody has made that claim.
In science, something is called a theory when it has never been shown to be wrong. Never, Disprove it even once, and it is abandoned or reworked. I won’t argue the point… this is how science works.
You can give definitions about science as much as you like, bingo being a strategy or not is debatable, not scientific, and a point of view not a fact.
You think it’s a strategy, and many seem to agree. Others disagree and don’t think it’s a strategy at all. There’s no science there. It’s like debating whether or not Graffiti is art. Some think it is, others don’t.
Science has nothing to do with whether or not bingo is a strategy, it’s a matter of perspective. Scientific facts are proven beyond any doubt. Subjective matters based on opinions aren’t.
There are many Styles of Kung-Fu , Karate , Ju-Gitsu , ect , ect
@1st glance… " Drunken Monkey " appears to be just that.
Random, without form or reason… I’m sure Chuck or Jackie
will explain its anything but…As for every Job, there’s prolly
“the right tool” for it.
You can call it many things… such as agressive/loose, but the
basic premise still exsists, forcing your opponent to put thier
tournament life on the line, if they are wrong, is a powerfull
weapon. Just as AA is.
Maya, I’m trying to come to a happy medium here, without
saying the same thing 20 times.
One psychological aspect of poker, is the ability to make your
opponents uncomfortable, thus increasing the odds that they
will make mistakes. So I’m quite sure there are times when
other ppl make any of us uncomfortable, or that some
aspects of Poker itself do that…
It might be that dirty look someone gives you across a table (live),
it might be that 4th raise in a row, beacuse you hate that, it might
be chatting alot in chat, just on various humdrum things that might
seem distracting, it might even be a suble comment… and yes,
it also can be that preflop All-In …
I’d like to help you somehow. Is that possible ? Clearly, there is a
miscommunication here, its ok to say… Sarah, am I hearing you
say “this, this,this” , can you clarify or re-phrase for me, cause it
just doesn’t add up for me. I’ve heard you say “I don’t like it” …
a thou times, I got that, can we move past that ? Please ??
( 101% no sarcasm )
Let me ask… so, how is it possible… to restrict NoLimit bets ?
What is the rule You would make ? How would that rule
be applied ? How would it stop an All-In ? ( ugg Bingo )
I care about your feelings, ideas, and point of view… but if you
can’t meet me 1/2 way, then I will stop trying…
Sarah, let me clarify one last time and after that to each their own:
When you play aggressively, to force your opponents out or to make them fold, in certain situations, that’s not bingo (at least not the bingo I am talking about, and this thread is about).
When you do it in rebuy tourneys during the rebuy period for certain goals and purposes, that’s not bingo.
These are situations where you do it as a clear strategy with a clear goal in mind.
Now, when you go all in preflop every single hand without any plan or purpose, exactly like it’s shown in this thread, with just about any 2 cards (10-2 suited or 2-4o etc…) for no reason, with no goal, just randomly, arbitrarily, this is pure bingo. It has no purpose, no plan, no goal, just ultimate “i’ll play like a lunatic and see if I hit or miss”.
You want to call this a strategy, fine, be my guest. SPG wants to call it science, fine, he can be my guest too. You will not change my perspective though: this is neither a strategy nor a play style.
Miri put it very well in her post above, in her example about dreams and lottery numbers. It’s just like that. I have 42o and I have a dream, I’ll go all in and see what happens.
I very much respect all your opinions and points of view on this matter, but mine remains that the specific type of bingo discussed in this post is not a strategy (good or bad), has no purpose, and neither serves the bingo player (who mostly will end up losing) nor the other players at the table (because such behavior is usually annoying, except to those who love to play against bingo players and always sure to beat them, in which case good for them).
There is no half way unfortunately. Nobody is asking to restrict NL bets, or to stop all ins, for goodness sake all ins make the game interesting for everyone… We’re just expressing how we feel about random baseless bingo, without even asking for it to be stopped. Is that so bad? I find it to be annoying, irritating, and not in any way a strategy. These are my feelings. Not asking for any rules to be changed or any restrictions to be made. Is that so much of a problem?
If you think about it, one could teach a 6 year old this “strategy” in about 5 minutes.
Whether bingo is a strategy depends on the definition of strategy. As a pragmatic point, I don’t care about the definition of strategy. I do care about it philosophically, but pragmatically I’m only concerned about how well it works, and how to counter it. Arguing about what counts as strategy won’t answer that question.
We can look at bingo like it’s a completely mindless approach to playing poker. And it is. But if you read my earlier posts in this thread, I did some armchair analysis on the strengths and weaknesses, as well as the psychology of playing against the bingo approach, and for being mindless, there’s still a lot there to be said about it. Which I think that means something.
Certainly, defeating bingo requires a non-trivial depth of poker insight, the guts to call and risk elimination, and even then, no small bit of luck. No wonder you hate playing against it.
If it’s a strategy, it’s a poor strategy, but it’s the strongest poor strategy. I’m not concerned with whether it’s a strategy. I’m only concerned about how to win.
I can’t help but this debate reminds me so much of Monty Python’s argument sketch.
You might say, it’s not at all like that, but I say, it is. No, it’s not, Yes, it is.
Well judge for yourself!
Is it all like that? I’m sure it’s not. Is it?
Contradiction or argument? Is my time up yet?
- All-in play should not be tampered with at all.
- Selective all-in play can be used highly effectively.
- Doesn’t mind playing against always all-in players.
- Suggests that since it is a consistent, deliberate action that it can be defined as a strategy in the loosest sense of the word.
- Some do want administrative action against this type of play, some do not.
- Is against always all-in players, but most are not against selective all-in players.
- Finds always all-in play annoying and disruptive.
- Suggests that since it requires no depth of thought that it cannot be defined as a strategy.
- Can we stop debating semantics and just play poker?
Bingo Players Should Not Be Banned
Sorry to be chiming in late on this, but 1st - SunPower, you are funny! I like YOUR strategy, lol! And I think bingo IS a good strategy for those that haven’t yet developed the ability to suss out opponents hands…I just HATE playing at a table with them! hahahaha!