i’m opening A6s
don’t open Axs?
shove on the flop?
back off when the pair flops
curse your bad luck?
i’m opening A6s
Most people will tell you don’t open A6. That’s pretty sound advice in most situations, but in certain situations it may be playable – short-handed tables, late position, when you’re short stacked and committed to the blinds, etc. Or if you’re at a table where open raises tend to close the action because you’re close to the bubble and everyone’s playing very tight (but then, it almost doesn’t matter what you raise with, unless you do get called).
A suited A6 is a little different. If you can see a cheap flop with A-suited, it’s sometimes worth chasing a flush draw, at least to see the flop, and then get away from the hand cheaply if you don’t see at least 2 of your suit. You can also hang in if you see 66, or AA, on the board. But if you see one Ace, you’ll need to be careful that you’re not beat by someone holding a better Ace.
On this specific hand, you hit the flush you were seeking, and go beat by a better hand. Not much you can do with it. Any time you see a pair on the board, it’s possible someone could have made a full house. If there’s a pair on the board, and someone is calling big bets, chances are good they have trips, or better. If they’re calling big bets with a pair on the board and four of the same suit, they either have a full house or a high flush.
You could shove on a paired flop, but if you do that you’re really repping trips, quads, or flopped full house. If you don’t have one of those, you’re only getting called by someone who has one of those hands, and so if you do get called, you’re screwing yourself. If no one on the table has it, they’ll fold to a lesser bet, even the min bet. I’ve hit so many trips on the flop, tried min-betting hoping to keep the table in, and ended up closing the hand. So rather than bet for value, a small feeler bet can be appropriate, but there’s nothing at all wrong with checking here, and calling bets if you feel like the odds are worthwhile to see if you hit the draw.
Just because a flush is a strong hand, and A-high flush is especially strong, doesn’t mean that you have to go all-in with it. Since the board pair appeared on the flop, you could have approached this hand with a certain degree of caution, and not raised the pot too much when your flush filled, and been content if you won a smaller pot. Leading out on the flop with the flush draw, and getting called, it’s a reasonable guess anyone calling here has trips. Also a possible over pair for a big two pair, but probably not the 4 for 2 pair the other way. After you get that call there, I’d be very cautious and slow down, maybe continue betting but not go high, and lay down if you get re-raised. The sick thing about filling the full house on the turn is, a good player is going to try to look weak and invite you to bet them. So checking here, it really could show actual weakness, but it’s also what a good player would do hitting the full house. You’ve already showed aggression, and it’s reasonable, even likely, to expect that you’d follow up with another bet if he checks, and of course he’s going to call and generally encourage you to put in as many chips as you’re comfortable, and then if there’s still anything left, raise you on the river. It’s a really tough situation to get out of, and the only question is how many chips will you have left. It’s especially hard when the hand that filled your draw also fills someone else’s better draw, as happened on the Turn here.
It sucks laying down a great hand, but sometimes you have to. It’s one of the harder things to do, and really it shows a lot of skill to be able to do so and for it to be the right move.
Here’s a similar hand I played to a better outcome recently. A pair of Queens comes on the flop, I’m drawing to a Broadway straight, hit it on the turn, my opponent was on AT and had two pair, drawing to a full house but not getting there. Was I taking a big risk getting them all-in here? Yes. Did I know I was going to win the hand? I hoped so, but I wasn’t sure. I just wanted to get a knockout if I did win, and if I lost I was going to be hurting but still with enough of a stack that I could conceivably come back from it, although it would have been tough. Knocking this guy out here put me heads-up against the last opponent, who only had <1000 chips in front of them, making winning the table all but assured.
thanks for the response, pug. all good advice. i think what drove my play today, were the games i had played prior to this one. in every one of them, my exit was the result of trying to get as much value as i could from made hands, while villain draws out a winner. this made me pursue the strategy of making people pay dearly to see a turn or river, once i made a hand i had confidence in, even if it meant a smaller pot. worked great, until it didn’t.
i actually had him on trip J, and many who play the cheaper games will bet that strongly on that hand, or weaker hands, for that matter. it’s hard to put a lot of the fine advice i get here into practice, because the logic just doesn’t apply like it would when playing more experienced players. i should have given the board pair more respect, but cursing my bad luck gets it’s due, as well.
Trying to make it short :
Limp (not open, open means raising) A6s… Hmm, you’re not deep, you should maybe think about shoving, or folding. If you limp, you’re often going to get beat by garbage hands from the SB and BB… But yeah, leally difficult to say, depends on your opponents and table mostly, but you could limp…
Flop : it’s either check/call. A bet is fine IMO, a check is also an option, considering your stack size… Then, great turn, why shove ? You have to try to value here, not scare off people who still got a pretty good hand but who will now be scared. Just bet, pretty big, maybe he has a J … so 60-80% I would say…
Unfortunately it’s just a huge setup, you couldn’t have avoided the shove in any way, if he had shoved for example… But yeah, definitely the shove on the turn wasn’t the best option, but I hope my tips are clear
@waidus part of the value of playing A6s is the blocker you have pre flop. Short handed and short stacked this should be “opened” for a raise not limped. I don’t like shoving the turn either, you’re letting your opponents off the hook with tons of their marginal holdings. I wouldn’t be surprised if you folded out trip J’s even. You’re stack size allows you to make normal bet sizing and still get it in on the river. Bet 4500 into 7 with his call that pot is 16K and you’ll have 15.5K back for river pot size shove.
28 bb’s is too deep to shove and A6s is too strong to fold. This just has to be a standard open even with the limper in. I think shoving starting around 20-22 bb’s over a limper is better and down to 15 bb’s if it’s folded to us in the CO. 28 bb’s is still plenty deep to play flops, turns and rivers.
Haha, I just wanted to post a new comment, because I miss calculated his amount of blinds, thought it was 18 … So yeah, you’re totally right, open (this time) here !
But with 18 BB’s it would be a fold or shove IMO though, like you said if I understand you correctly.
Yepperz! Yeah, 18 bb’s the math decides.
Even tho i didn’t play, i watched almost all ‘The big game’ clips on youtube. yesterday, i went back and rewatched a few episodes. it was like seeing the world after you got the glasses you needed. suddenly, i not only saw what they were doing, but why they did what they did. before, i knew nothing of table position, pot odds, ect. thanks to you guys for all the advice, hints and explanations.
at least my range is no longer 52 cards, lol.
in an SnG yesterday, i hit 3 or 4 sets and a couple of trips in the first 20 or so hands, giving me a stack lead that even a rookie couldn’t screw up. hard to gripe about other people getting lucky, after that.
Cheers… keep crushin!!