@SSeville
I understand from your profile and the posts you have made, that you have been involved in the casino and card room industry for a number of years so I wonder if you would be the man to consider a question that I can’t seem to find a definitive answer for. It is in parts but all related.
Is it within the rules of hold’em to play your cards face up or to announce your hole cards to the table before any action has happened?.
Is it within the rules to announce your cards and shove all-in when it is your turn to act?
Is it within the rules to announce all-in until I’m cleaned out and then ship,ship ship ship
I know it is foolish play and probably the fastest way to the poor-house, but I would really like to know is it breaking the rules
Any others out there who may actually know the ruling on this please jump in
Someone else had a question about this a while ago, or at least about a part of it. This is the excerpt from the rulebook (Tournament Directors Association). However, this is for tournament play only and you didn’t specify whether you were referring to them or to cash games.
From the TDA rulebook:
_62: No Disclosure Players must protect other players in the tournament at all times. Therefore players, whether in the hand or not, must not: _ _. Disclose contents of live or folded hands, _ _. Advise or criticize play at any time, _ . Read a hand that hasn’t been tabled. One-player-to-a-hand is in effect. Among other things, this rule prohibits showing a hand to or discussing strategy with another player, advisor, or spectator.
Actually, in the event you are probably thinking of, he was very careful not to disclose the specific contents of his hand. You are 100% allowed to lie but you can’t reveal your actual holdings while the hand is live.
My answer should be exactly correct for California and generally correct for Nevada. There are some significant variations in some of the other states and I have no knowledge regarding this topic in other countries.
California had a major change in the composition and operation of its Gaming Commission. At that time the instituted a regulation that all card rooms had to submit a list of all types of poker games they would spread in their establishment along with a complete set of the rules they would play by. We were free to make any rules we chose. A couple results from that action is that the official rules vary from establishment to establishment. Also many variations of Texas Holdem came to be. Some of those are Pineapple, Crazy Pineapple, Toledo, No Foldem Holdem and some others.
In some areas Casinos and card rooms got together and tried to agree to a set of rules so it was the same for all the players in the area. This worked to some degree, but not consistant throughout the industry. Several years ago the same thing was tried with the color of chips. Many disagreements on that so still a lot of variance.
Soooooo, in answer to your question, It all depends on how the rules were written when submitted to the Gaming Comission. If there were major flaws in them they could be amended, but requires a lot of paperwork. Also, the establishment is like God when it comes to any disagreements or questions from the players.
I think you would find the answer an any card room for those questions to be the same. NO. They would not allow a player to make these announcements. The first two because they can harm or help certain players in the hand.
In the third case it would be NO, because each player must play his own hand. In regular play the chips bet must go into the pot and be put there by you. The dealer or another player could do that for you.
The only thing that might be allowed in some places would be the third situation if it was in a tournament. Even then, I think most floormen or managers would ask the players if they had any objections to this, and if there were, not allow it.
ps, I became a players rep yesterday. I hope those of you who do not like the reps will not hold it against me. I felt like I would enjoy giving a little back and I really like all of the staff I have met. Giving up some of my playing time and I have to miss the MTT championship tourney Sunday because we have a reps meeting at the same time. But I still feel pretty good about it.
I made that post about a week ago on Live games versus online. I had planned on more, but so far received no feedback here on the forum. I had one person contact me directly saying they liked it and wanted some more of it. But thought I would ask you all. Any interest? If not I will just drop it.
I just reread my first post and see a couple of typos. The one that is important is the next to the last paragraph in my answer to your question. It should say The dealer or another player could NOT do that for you.
Welcome to the Players Rep group, and YES, I would love more posts like you’ve provided. I am mostly self-taught and appreciate everything I can get my hands on to help me be a more alert, strategic, WINNING player, with a little less emotion when I’m playing. If I can get my head in the loop, usually my heart sits back with a sigh of relief.
Jan
Congrats Seville. I’m sure you will be great at it. Your specific knowledge of the industry cant be anything but a plus for everyone here.
As to your thread on live vs online - I think its a great idea. I may offer a bit of marketing advice though - start with an opening scene, not with the production credits Maybe something a little sexier than the chemical composition of the standard felt surface? Everything you said was interesting and I’m sure people would read it and get into it but it may not have been the best place to start if you wanted to peak peoples interest levels.
Can’t wait to read more though, honestly. Online and live poker are very different beasts and those differences are both interesting and useful to understand.
[quote=“Seville, post:27, topic:6655”]
and I have to miss the MTT championship tourney Sunday because we have a reps meeting
[/quote]Well thats a crock of crap, do you know how hard that promo is, even tho they made it easier… they should chg the time of the meeting… thats dumb.
Thank you for your input.
I started to write it a little more differently which would have probably made it more interesting for those who have played live, then decided to keep it pretty basic for the newer players. I will finish with the equipment in the next installment and it should get a little sexier for the readers who are knowledgeable of poker online, but not live.There are so many things different in live play than online. I thought I would incorporate a little insider information that even the customers in cardrooms don’t see. Lots of things that only those working in the industry are exposed to. And some things that only owners or upper management ever deal with. It is a very small number of people that have ever been in the counting room of a Casino or card room.
Maybe I could run the next one by you and you could edit it for me to make it better before I post it ?
Thank you for your kind comments. I couldn’t expect them to do that. I kept them waiting for some time while I considered if I wanted to take this on or not, and then they were kind to delay my starting for a month while I traveled a lot in June.
They have a hard time scheduling a meeting where all the people can attend because of the time differences all over the world. That time on Sunday seems to be the best for all.
Seville - I am as eager to hear about your experiences as anyone, maybe more so. As I’ve said, I’m a fan of the industry and the mechanics of it. Also, I didn’t even think about people who haven’t been in a card room or casino. The online world is the new and weird one to me so maybe I’m totally off base on what someone who doesn’t have that experience would find most interesting? Could very well be and if so, I apologize.
From other businesses that I analyze and marketing firms I’ve worked with, I have learned that people don’t have a very large attention span and the opportunity to get them to read anything more than the headline is miniscule. Once they start paying attention though, there is a good chance they will read/view through whatever it is you are presenting.
I’d be happy to look at anything you have if that is a sincere wish. I don’t think you need any content edits though, just something to capture the reader at the start. Heck, mention the counting room and that itself is going to get peoples attention.
As always, I enjoy your posts and appreciate the insights.
Thank you . That was exactly the answer I was looking for but couldn’t seem to find it.
I do like your post on online versus live and hope you find the time for many more posts so that we all may benefit from your experience inside the game.
Thanks again,
who
I appreciate the support.
I am starting today on writing up the next installment on this topic. I hope to finish up with the equipment. I know it may be a little redundant and boring to those who have played some in card rooms, but some who have played online only probably have never seen or used some of it so I thought it would be beneficial to them.
Looking forward to seeing you Yiazmat at that meeting. Hopefully we can both find the room lol.
Warlock, I was serious, I would be grateful if you would edit and critique the next segment of this post when I get it done. Let me know how to get it to you when it is done. Thank you
Seville - would be my pleasure to help any way I can. You are already on my friends list so just message it to me there or I can send you my email address if that is better for you.
Maybe something a little sexier than the chemical composition of the standard felt surface? Everything you said was interesting and I’m sure people would read it and get into it but it may not have been the best place to start if you wanted to peak peoples interest levels.